Comments on: Sullied-arity http://www.johninnit.co.uk/2007/02/27/sullied-arity/ Scrapbook of a labor-geek - Unions 2.0 in the UK and around the world Thu, 04 Dec 2008 20:18:18 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.2 By: admin http://www.johninnit.co.uk/2007/02/27/sullied-arity/#comment-52 admin Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:02:18 +0000 http://www.johninnit.co.uk/?p=79#comment-52 Agreed that it is having an effect in Poland, Patrick. There's a shortage of plumbers for example, and they're instead hiring lots of Ukrainians to fill the roles. Much of this is temporary as younger people come here to learn and earn (and pay tax) whilst they have the opportunity, and there's indeed evidence that some are returning already. The labour market isn't always a zero sum, and Eastern European migrants are tending to go for areas where there is a labour shortage rather than surplus - they can't afford to stay if they aren't getting enough work. Problems of undercutting and lowering of conditions are not caused by the migrants themselves, but by bad bosses who are looking to exploit their situation, and in some cases break the law. Unions *are* speaking out on these issues, by insisting on solidarity with migrants in cases where this is happening. Insist on the same standards for everyone, and you can stop exploitation of a minority causing detriment to all. Agreed that it is having an effect in Poland, Patrick. There’s a shortage of plumbers for example, and they’re instead hiring lots of Ukrainians to fill the roles. Much of this is temporary as younger people come here to learn and earn (and pay tax) whilst they have the opportunity, and there’s indeed evidence that some are returning already.

The labour market isn’t always a zero sum, and Eastern European migrants are tending to go for areas where there is a labour shortage rather than surplus - they can’t afford to stay if they aren’t getting enough work. Problems of undercutting and lowering of conditions are not caused by the migrants themselves, but by bad bosses who are looking to exploit their situation, and in some cases break the law.

Unions *are* speaking out on these issues, by insisting on solidarity with migrants in cases where this is happening. Insist on the same standards for everyone, and you can stop exploitation of a minority causing detriment to all.

]]> By: Patrick Harrington http://www.johninnit.co.uk/2007/02/27/sullied-arity/#comment-45 Patrick Harrington Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:17:11 +0000 http://www.johninnit.co.uk/?p=79#comment-45 Many people in Poland are concerned at the fact that so many are leaving to work abroad. Poland does not have surplus population (as was the case in the West Indies in the 50s). Surely you can understand that the fact that France and Germany imposed restrictions and the UK did not distorted the market impact on the UK economy and has placed us in a position where labour rates in certain industries are kept artificially static? Surely it is the job of UK Unions to speak out on issues like this which impact on ordinary workers? There is a wider issue still when we consider how parasitic our Health Service is on developing nations. Take a look at the stats for South Africa and the impact of developing nations buying-up their skilled professionals. I don't expect you to say we are 100% real but at least accept that your simplistic presentation is off the mark. Many people in Poland are concerned at the fact that so many are leaving to work abroad. Poland does not have surplus population (as was the case in the West Indies in the 50s). Surely you can understand that the fact that France and Germany imposed restrictions and the UK did not distorted the market impact on the UK economy and has placed us in a position where labour rates in certain industries are kept artificially static? Surely it is the job of UK Unions to speak out on issues like this which impact on ordinary workers?

There is a wider issue still when we consider how parasitic our Health Service is on developing nations. Take a look at the stats for South Africa and the impact of developing nations buying-up their skilled professionals. I don’t expect you to say we are 100% real but at least accept that your simplistic presentation is off the mark.

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